Seriously Ford?

[2 Jeeps and a Mustang wants a Fiata]

Why is this piece of crap two piece driveshaft in my car?! FRPP upgrade in foreground.

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

Why is this piece of crap two piece driveshaft in my car?! FRPP upgrade in foreground.

The safety factor (critical driveshaft speed), NVH, and durability targets are much more conservative for OEM's versus aftermarket...

You'll probably be ok, but a longer single driveshaft would not likely pass Ford's powertrain durability testing.

[2 Jeeps and a Mustang wants a Fiata]

Which is crazy with prior generations using a one piece. Also this driveshaft is made by Dana.

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

Which is ctazy with prior generations using a one piece. Also this driveshaft is made by Dana.

FDR and Tire diameter impact the speed of the driveshaft, too...

It is odd that they abandoned a single segment driveshaft for an arguably more expensive two-segment driveshaft... My 157" WB F150 has a two-segment driveshaft, and yet there are aftermarket single segment driveshafts available... That's a little nutty IMHO, although I have 3.31 FDR axles, so it's not TOO bad from an RPM perspective.

[Just Jeepin']

Did a little digging out of curiosity; I guess a two-piece can be built to better withstand high RPM?

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/0608rc-driveshaft-tech/

[ForSweden]

@doodon2whls if it's not under warranty, Ford cares less if it breaks before 100,000 miles

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

Which is ctazy with prior generations using a one piece. Also this driveshaft is made by Dana.

Do a search for "Critical Driveshaft Speed"

[Nauraushaun]

@doodon2whls Wouldn't a single piece be more durable? Less stuff to go wrong!

[doodon2whls]

@nauraushaun said in Seriously Ford?:

@doodon2whls Wouldn't a single piece be more durable? Less stuff to go wrong!

All rotating components experience cyclical loading which impacts the lifespan / durability of the component. CV or double cardan joints can help reduce sinusoidal driveshaft speed/acceleration. The Length/Diameter ratio of the driveshaft is a primary factor in the critical driveshaft speed - the speed above which premature, unpredictable driveshaft failure may occur. There are 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th order driveshaft frequencies that all contribute to durability and NVH of the drive system... Segmenting the driveshaft in two is a calculated engineering decision which considers all of these factors, and includes cost an additional confounding factor. Two piece driveshafts could be more expensive, but much more durable due to the higher critical driveshaft speed.

Vehicle Systems are far more complicated (from an engineering perspective) than the general public can even fathom. As a former performance vehicle development engineer, this is a reality that I still live with to this day...

[3point8isgreat]

@nauraushaun No, because longer shafts vibrate more at a given speed. And most things on a factory car will be limited by fatigue life, not max strength. And vibration is a major driver of fatigue.

[Exage03040]

It's been a while since had a look at V6 Mustang Driveshaft Failures [explosions] on YouTube.

[3point8isgreat]

@doodon2whls Mmm yes. Shoot that engineering speak straight into my veins. Thats the good stuff.

[VincentMalamute]

@doodon2whls Thanks, I always like the engineering explanations. Everything is more complicated than it looks at first glance. Cars, bicycles, economics, national and foreign policy.

[doodon2whls]

@3point8isgreat said in Seriously Ford?:

@doodon2whls Mmm yes. Shoot that engineering speak straight into my veins. Thats the good stuff.

C'est mon plaisir, monsieur !

[doodon2whls]

@vincentmalamute said in Seriously Ford?:

@doodon2whls Thanks, I always like the engineering explanations. Everything is more complicated than it looks at first glance. Cars, bicycles, economics, national and foreign policy.

Imagine my horror when I frequented the enthusiast forums for the vehicle for which I was the development engineer. I read (and replied to) more posts than I care to remember about replacing OEM parts with aftermarket parts that 'looked fast', but in reality degraded performance, durability, efficiency, etc... As a fellow enthusiast, I certainly appreciated the enthusiasm, but it pained me to read some of that stuff.

[VincentMalamute]

@doodon2whls said in Seriously Ford?:

but in reality degraded performance, durability, efficiency, etc... As a fellow enthusiast, I certainly appreciated the enthusiasm, but it pained me to read some of that stuff.

I feel your pain. Life is much easier if one can reduce one's grasp of a complex topic to a single sentence (it's shiny so it's better!). An in-depth understanding of engineering, a car modification, surgical procedure, or immigration policy isn't necessary.

[Exage03040]

@doodon2whls said in Seriously Ford?:

Imagine my horror when I frequented the enthusiast forums for the vehicle for which I was the development engineer.

The worst.
Especially the correct but not really because it's severely outdated information debates.
I can only sit and laugh at those now, there's just no point in engaging.

[doodon2whls]

@exage03040 said in Seriously Ford?:

@doodon2whls said in Seriously Ford?:

Imagine my horror when I frequented the enthusiast forums for the vehicle for which I was the development engineer.

The worst.
Especially the correct but not really because it's severely outdated information debates.
I can only sit and laugh at those now, there's just no point in engaging.

"I'm telling you, my dad and his dad always let their car warm up 5 minutes before driving it. Their cars lasted almost 100,000 miles !"
<facepalm>

"If you don't want your car engine to smoke, run 20W50 oil. It's thicker, so it wont leak past the piston rings or valve guides."

and a thousand more just like those...

[2 Jeeps and a Mustang wants a Fiata]

When I pulled my transmission out to do the clutch I was shocked to find this driveshaft setup under the car. It's pretty heavy and according to ford "not servicable" also has a sticker saying "not usable if dropped". I upgraded to this one for lighter weight and the Dana 1310 u-joints.

[BaconSandwich]

@doodon2whls Oh man. I'd love to pick your brain at some point. I love hearing the in-depth explanations on stuff like that.

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

When I pulled my transmission out to do the clutch I was shocked to find this driveshaft setup under the car. It's pretty heavy and according to ford "not servicable" also has a sticker saying "not usable if dropped". I upgraded to this one for lighter weight and the Dana 1310 u-joints.

With a 107-ish inch wheelbase, I am surprised that the Mustang has a two segment driveshaft, but coming from the Industry, I can tell you that there was a compelling set of data and analysis that substantiated the complexity that a two segment driveshaft requires over a single segment unit.

RE: the non serviceable and "don't use if dropped" warning: If you ding a driveshaft, the resulting stress riser and possible geometric distortion will likely lead to vibration and premature driveshaft failure. Ford (and other manufacturers) are not willing to leave the safety of it's customers to the judgement call of a field technician or engineer. The cost of the replacement parts is much less than a damaged driveline (or worse) when it fails. 'Cheap Insurance'...

Like I said - you'll probably be ok, bit there was a good reason that the driveshaft was segmented by design.

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

When I pulled my transmission out to do the clutch I was shocked to find this driveshaft setup under the car. It's pretty heavy and according to ford "not servicable" also has a sticker saying "not usable if dropped". I upgraded to this one for lighter weight and the Dana 1310 u-joints.

The driveshaft (with u-joints) does not spin at a constant angular velocity.

[2 Jeeps and a Mustang wants a Fiata]

@exage03040 I showed those videos to my girlfriend last week and she was shocked but I've always found it satisfying.

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

@exage03040 I showed those videos to my girlfriend last week and she was shocked but I've always found it satisfying.

Yup. Empirical evidence of physical phenomena is always satisfying.

[doodon2whls]

@2-jeeps-and-a-mustang-wants-a-fiata said in Seriously Ford?:

@exage03040 I showed those videos to my girlfriend last week and she was shocked but I've always found it satisfying.

Oh, and notice the OEM segmented driveshaft from your car has two constant velocity joints and one u-joint. That is a pricey assembly!